Transcript
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Welcome back everyone.
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God's diamonds in the rough, Amen.
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We are so glad to be back with you one more time.
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If you don't forgot who we are, I'm Catherine.
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And I'm Michael.
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Yep, and we are so glad to be before you.
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Amen.
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We have a special guest with us today, amen, and her name is Katrina Robinson.
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Amen, we've been fighting to try to get her on this show Sickness, hell and high water.
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We was just having a hard time.
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But, to God, be the glory, we are here and we are all ready to be of service to everyone that is listening.
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Katrina, you want to say hello to everyone.
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Sure, yeah, I'm glad that I'm here and I'm looking forward to the opportunity to talk to you guys, and I'm glad you guys are well again and we were able to make this happen.
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Amen, yes, hallelujah.
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So, before we go any further with the conversation, y'all know what we are going to do.
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Let us pray, dear Heavenly Father, our Lord and our Savior, jesus Christ, we come to you right now, with boldness, with authority that you have given us, to say thank you.
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Thank you for your grace and your mercy, thank you for just being the God that you are in our lives.
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We pray in the name of Jesus, counseling any assignment of the enemy that will be sent back into the picture of where it came from.
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We pray in the name of Jesus that you will just have your way.
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We pray in the name of Jesus that you will just have your way.
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We ask your forgiveness for anything we might have said, done or thought that's not pleasing your sight.
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That your grace will forgive us and catch us back into the picture of where it came from.
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We pray in the name of Jesus for the ones that have no desire to know who you are.
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We pray in the name of Jesus for the ones that want to know who you are but don't know how.
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We pray for the ones that know you, have you as a relationship, but just want some help, praying for their health and their strength.
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We pray in the name of Jesus interceding on their behalf.
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We pray in the name of Jesus once again that your Holy Spirit will just have its way.
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In Jesus Christ's holy and maximum name, we say thank you.
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Thank you.
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And we say amen, amen, amen and amen.
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Amen, amen, amen.
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So, everyone, today we are going to be talking about um, when our feelings don't align with that of truth.
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Well, sure and gosh, where to even start with it.
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You know, first I'll say that, you know, just from the perspective of a woman and I'm sure you know not to say that men don't have emotions but I think us, as women, we tend to be very much more kind of emotional beings, right, and all of us know that this life throws some doozies at us.
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We kind of have that rug yanked out from underneath of us or almost feel like we've been sucker punched, and you know it is.
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And I'll back up by saying that I've always been very vulnerable and transparent with my emotions, like on my social media platforms.
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And I've adopted.
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My husband and I we have five children, three of them we adopted from foster care.
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We're two from foster care, one, he was actually an adult when we adopted.
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I was always very vulnerable and transparent with some really hard things we were walking through with these boys and you know, so the emotions would make me want to say you know, did God really lead us to do this?
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You know, is God out to get us?
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You know, I mean, did we?
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Is our?
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Is our prayers not reaching him?
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Does he not hear us?
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Does he not see us?
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Did we miss him somewhere.
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And I was always, I've always been very transparent with those emotions and I I'm not afraid to voice them, to voice some really hard questions.
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You know, kind of that sit in your ash pile and weep, kind of thing, but then you know you can't stay there, you can't get stuck.
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You kind of have to wipe your face and stand back up and say, and that's where that true faith comes in, right Of that, even though nothing makes sense, nothing feels right, I'm feeling very uncertain at the moment.
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Still I will trust in him, still I believe that his word is true and that's where that faith of taking that next step, even though it doesn't make sense or feel right, comes in.
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Amen.
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So you know I kind of jumped the gun with the topic.
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And so we're going to kind of rewind, just a little bit, and I want to ask you to share with our audience why you are able to be a one to answer this question.
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Who are you?
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Tell us a little bit about your background, that's why I kind of jumped the gun.
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I kind of went in.
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Right, right.
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So, um, you know I'm, I'm really not anybody special, I'm just your, your average, uh, american woman.
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I uh, my husband and I have been married 27 years.
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He was was a pastor for 20 plus years, now he's a chaplain, so I've worn that, you know, pastor's wife hat for for a long time and all of the kind of living in the glass house that that comes with.
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But we, like I said before, we um, have five children, two biological, three adopted by trade.
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I'm a financial advisor, um, but then, um, and I guess what kind of led me to this place of doing podcasts and stuff is, at the beginning of this year I published a book called juror number 11.
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Uh, and it was a meme and the subtitle is A Memoir of the Broken Justice System and Rising Through the Trials of Life.
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And, like I said, I have always been very vulnerable and transparent on social media and over the years I'd have people tell me, gosh, you should write a book, and I always kind of, I don't have time for that wasn't really interested.
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Well then, last year I went through just this horrific season where I was asked to serve on the jury for a murder trial in which, after it was all over.
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I ended up with contempt of court charges and faced my own trial, the possibility of jail time, a new judge steps in, a mistrial is found.
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I mean, it was just.
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It was five months of just awfulness and I, you know, through it all I was kind of like God, are you going to fight for me or not?
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You know, I thought your promise said you'd fight for us and I felt very, very alone.
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And when that season came to a close, I was kind of like you know what?
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I'm going to write that book, and so it's a memoir and it just covers five months, but within that five month period I also take the opportunity to kind of enter, weave into the story some of the really heartbreaking things that I was walking through with some of my children as well.
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Throughout the book is choosing to rise, no matter what it is that life throws at you, and I guess, um, I'm one of those who's not a not afraid to.
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Um, you know, everybody likes to hear the um, the feel good stories about having faith, right, you know, um.
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You know, like, one of my very most favorite passages in the Bible is Hebrews, chapter 11, which is often referred to as the hall of faith where it starts out walking, you know, walking through all of these individuals that they name by name, that we're all familiar with, and it outlines all the miracles that they experienced because of their faith, from the mouths of the lions being shut to individuals being raised from the dead.
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But then, right there in the middle, there's a section that is often glossed over, and it is where it talks about all the unnamed individuals too many to name whose promises were not received but yet they still had the same faith, and it says you know, the world was not worthy of them.
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And sometimes I think that we as Christians believe that if you, because you have faith, everything's going to work out, and nobody wants to talk about when it doesn't work out, because that may be a poor reflection on them, maybe because their faith wasn't strong enough, or they weren't praying right, or they had hidden sin or whatever it may be, and so they don't talk about it.
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But you know, and so I.
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Anyway, when I wrote the book I had, I was really kind of surprised at the positive reaction that I had to it, of people reaching out and telling me how much it encouraged them, which was really not what I was expecting is a unique one.
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People could relate to the just heartbreaking situations that God doesn't seem to be coming through for you on, but still choosing to have faith in him.
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So yeah, so that's kind of my story in a nutshell.
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Amen, amen.
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Michael, you had a thought while she was talking.
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I was.
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You know, I was in I don't know how to explain it, because something similar to what you were saying.
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You know, I just had my encounter with jury selection and I was encounter with jury selection.
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Okay, and I was.
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You know, I've been brought up in a way, followed after John when he says judge ye not that, with what measure ye judge, the same shall be judged unto you, right, and I got to thinking about it, about that verse, and it was like so ain't that what we're doing when we're on the jury?
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We're judging somebody Absolutely.
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Absolutely, and that was yeah, go ahead.
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And I got to the point where I was like you know what, no, I'm not, I'm not going to jury selection.
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They set it for this date and they had it set up where you had to call a certain number the day before, the night before Right, to see if you had to go, and about five or six times they canceled it and moved it to another date and I was like you know what?
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My life is not going to be revolved of pleasing man and being on the jury.
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So I wrote out a letter explaining my case and I didn't get a chance to send it off because I lost the address to who I had to send it to.
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The judges are, I guess, secretary, like I had to send it to the judges, are, I guess, secretary?
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Like a clerk or something.
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And I was like you know what?
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I can't do this.
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I cannot go before and judge somebody.
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Because you've got to realize, look, when we take that oath to judge somebody, we've got to realize that, look, I'm not going to do it, so they might have this crime.
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But what if you did something and somebody had to judge your faith of where you was at?
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We got to realize that, if we all want to get the same result and come to the light, how can we as Christians, as believers, as followers of Jesus Christ, judge another person?
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Because when we judge that person, we're pushing them further and further and further into darkness.
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We are supposed to be as Christians.
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We are supposed to bring those people out of the darkness into the marvelous light.
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How can we sit there and judge somebody that's pushing them further back into the darkness?
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Yeah, and that's something that I was very in the book.
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I'm very transparent with those exact emotions that I was dealing with while serving.
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It was a four-day trial and the burden I felt, the responsibility I felt to, like you say, literally judge somebody, issue a verdict and give them a sentencing, was absolutely horrific for me to walk through.
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And you know, and I kind of had this fantasy idea that our justice system was all about truth and justice, right, but what I realized sitting on a four-day trial is it's about manipulation, it's about power plays, it's about using rules for individuals own advantage rather than what those rules are intended to protect and provide for.
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I found out, evidence is delivered in emotionally manipulative ways, Facts are cherry picked and, as a jury member, you're not allowed to ask questions.
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You're, um, everything is dumbed down, Um, you, you know, and without going into all of the details, it would, it would take too long, but I I really struggled with the fact that we and that's really what wound up me getting in trouble so this woman was charged with first degree murder and I absolutely could not go there and we went into deliberations.
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It was just me and one other person that were saying not guilty on first degree murder.
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But after just an emotional breakdown from me and a couple hours later we re-vote and we all went not guilty on first degree murder.
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Individuals could like take such a decision so flippantly.
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You know what I mean.
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But I was pushed into this spot where, you know so, whenever they you know there's 12 people that sit on a jury and then they always choose two alternates that are there available in case, for some reason, one or two of those 12 are not able to complete the whole process, there's two that have kind of sat through the whole thing that can step in.
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Well, both of those alternates had already been used up and you know, I almost felt like I was in a position where it's like, you know, you guys have not given us the full picture to be able to issue a verdict that I feel comfortable with.
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But if I were to have recused myself, it would have resulted in a hung jury because there were no alternates to step in.
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So I had to kind of go back with OK, we are forced to make a decision based only on what was presented during this trial.
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That's how our justice system works.
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So, even though my heart and my gut was saying something else.
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It was not because of anything that was presented in the trial.
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You see what I'm saying.
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And so what ended up happening was we ended up going with, you know, not guilty on first degree murder, but guilty on second degree murder the moment in the deliberation room when we each went around the table saying either guilty or not guilty, and I was the very last person to give the verbal vote and I said I never realized how difficult it would be to utter the words guilty about another human being, especially when I was forced to do so with what I did not feel was the full and accurate picture of the situation, the situation.
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And then.
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So, if you know, want to, you know, maybe give you a little bit of a cliffhanger there for the listeners of, or of, kind of like, the end of the story.
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First of all, that you know, like I said that because I ended up being charged with contempt of court and you'll just have to, I guess, read the book to find out how that happened but and another judge stepped in and granted a mistrial, but then, so anyway, the cliffhanger is that the mistrial never actually ended up happening.
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It was just another layer of just the whole debacle of the whole situation, layer of just the whole debacle of the whole situation.
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But then so the defendant.
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So the defendant was a 60 year old woman, never been in trouble, piano teacher.
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She had shot and killed her husband.
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Her defense was self-defense, Defense was self-defense, no evidence that had anything to do with his particular whole ordeal.
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I felt like, you know, I don't use any names in the book, but I, since she's kind of one of the main characters, I felt like I should just let her know I was writing a book.
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And well, I'll tell, I'll tell you this.
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Um, so her response to me so she, she is in prison, uh, was, uh, Yahweh has used you to preserve my life and no matter what happens, I will forever be thanking you, uh, thanking him for you.
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And and now, um, I've actually, you know, I talked to her just about an hour ago on the phone.
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We talk regularly.
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She teaches my son piano via Zoom from a prison.
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So you know, I mean, that's just kind of one of those crazy.
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You know, God's hand is still in it.
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So you know, with everything being said and that has been said, truth still didn't change.
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You know what I mean?
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And that's our reality.
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Is that?
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You know, even when we're in places we don't want to be and we're in positions and you know, in trials and tribulations that challenge truth, we have to be confident, knowing that the truth doesn't change based on how they feel about it, even how you feel about it, you know what I mean, Because it's like I'm sure you had a point.
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Well, why did you choose me to be here, you?
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Know how I feel about this I don't want to sit back and have to judge whether she goes to prison or not.
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I don't want to do that, and sometimes I think, that you know we get in those positions and it's like it's really more than anything God's saying.
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I want you to trust me.
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What do you think?
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Right, yeah, and even, like you know, situations like with my adopted sons, where that was something where we were experiencing this heartbreak, really as a direct result, because we followed Christ.
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You see what I'm saying and it's like, you know, blessed that I mean.
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Obviously God's will is that everybody would come to know him, and you know, but it just, you know, like so one of I remember one particular Sunday when I was just kind of in the midst of just I mean, it just seemed like it was one of those seasons where every single morning you kind of wake up and you're like what's going to fall apart today, what's going to go wrong today?
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And the preacher at our church, he's kind of one of those just fireballs, energizer, bunny, like always excited, always happy, always optimistic, which is great.
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There's absolutely nothing wrong with that.
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I envy that actually.
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But you know, there was one Sunday morning when I was just in the midst of a really dark season and he was kind of in this, you know, you just need to be positive and always be grateful and I just wasn't there, you know, and he had even referenced Job in the sermon and you know, I which you know, I was kind of like gosh, he's kind of a poor example to reference when you're talking about being thankful, because I ended up going home and going back to the book of Job and reading it and Job was absolutely not joyful or thankful through that period of time when Satan was allowed to literally take everything from him.
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You know, job was an honest man and very vocal with his emotions.
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You know he says you know God doesn't hear me.
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God is out to get me.
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You know God has turned his face from me.
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You know, and it's kind of like you know, gosh, when you're around somebody that's like yeah, they're going through a hard time, but you get tired of listening to him.
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It's like no wonder his wife and his friends all left him.
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But he was able to say, though he slay me yet I will trust him.
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So I'm just kind of one of those that doesn't brush over the fact that you're going to face some trials and tribulations in this world, even though you've got faith.
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Absolutely.
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Can you say that again?
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Can you say that again.
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Yeah, yeah, you're going to face trials and tribulations even though you have faith.
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Sometimes you're going to face trials and tribulation because of your faith.
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That's it.
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That's it I mean, and that's what we got to know, and you know, here's the reality.
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Just as hard as it was for her to make that guilty or not guilty decision, imagine how hard that is for the father when you know when he wants to find he wants to find his children not guilty, but the reality is because they didn't trust him and have a relationship with him.
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They're guilty because they got to be judged by the law.
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That's the same reality is that just as hard as it was for her?
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I'm sure it's got to be hard for him.
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You know what I mean when people don't trust him with their heart.
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Is that just as hard as it was for her?
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I'm sure it's got to be hard for him.
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You know what I mean when people don't trust him with their heart Right.
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You know, and really you know my experience with you know my adopted kids that you know I mean they did come from horrific trauma.
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You know I mean they did come from horrific trauma, like there are reasons for all of their behaviors and that kind of thing.
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But you know I did everything possible to put all the resources into their hands and the love and the guidance and the boundaries no-transcript, you know you kind of feel like you know.
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Well, actually there is this one.
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He wasn't a kid I adopted but you know I did everything possible to try to help him turn his life around, to basically throw away everything I had given him and blame the predicament he had found himself on me.
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And you know, and I think you know, when you look at what Christ has done for us, how horrible is it.
00:26:53.798 --> 00:26:56.383
Like I know how he would feel when we say you didn't love us enough, you didn't do enough.
00:26:56.383 --> 00:27:17.809
Like how you know and I hope that this is, you know I'm having trouble kind of articulating my words but like how offensive it is when one of these children that I've, you know, poured, you know, not just financial resources but emotional resources and my blood, sweat and tears into them, for them to say I didn't do enough, like I, that how could you um accuse me of not loving you?
00:27:17.809 --> 00:27:25.568
And then so to turn that back on ourselves is, how can we accuse God of not loving us?
00:27:25.568 --> 00:27:28.613
You know so.
00:27:28.613 --> 00:27:56.796
So, so yeah, I just, you know another character, one of my favorite like female Old Testament characters is Naomi, and she was another one of the characters I turned to when I was just kind of in a dark place, you know, and you've got to go to the book of Ruth to find Naomi and of course Ruth is kind of the hero of that story.
00:27:57.346 --> 00:28:18.895
But the book starts out with Naomi and she and her husband and her sons, you know, have to flee their land because of famine and they get there and now, if you're familiar with the story, you know, her husband dies, both of her sons they get married, they die before they have any children.
00:28:18.895 --> 00:28:39.770
Um, naomi, you know, gets word that the famine's over in her land, so she decides she's going to head back and then that's when ruth kind of becomes the hero of the story when she insists on going back and staying with naomi, even though she has no obligation to to.
00:28:39.770 --> 00:28:53.192
But you realize, naomi's kind of become this like cranky, bitter old woman, and that is what makes Ruth even more of a hero, in that she insists on, like, staying committed to her.
00:28:53.192 --> 00:28:55.699
So, anyway, naomi gets back to her land.
00:28:55.699 --> 00:28:59.712
All the women greet her excitedly that she's back.
00:28:59.792 --> 00:29:07.597
It's apparent she must have been a well-known and respected woman, and her response to them again I like just honest, vulnerable people.
00:29:07.597 --> 00:29:15.358
Her response is don't call me Naomi, because the Lord has made me bitter.
00:29:15.358 --> 00:29:23.337
He sent me away full and brought me back empty, and you know that probably shut all those women up.
00:29:23.337 --> 00:29:26.255
It's like you know, let's tread lightly with Naomi.
00:29:26.255 --> 00:29:28.212
I actually looked up what Naomi meant.
00:29:28.285 --> 00:29:33.394
It means gentle and pleasant, and she was honest enough to say you know what?
00:29:33.394 --> 00:30:31.516
God did this to me and I'm not happy about it, but I don't think she ever lost her faith in him, because the book ends with, uh, that first grandson being placed on her lap and then, if you read the gene, gene, genealogy, um, she's included in the line of Christ and so, and I guess the reason why I like her in that story is that God was okay with her voicing how much she was hurting and and I guess the reality is that, like you, you know God you could have, you could have made this easier on me, and God was OK with her voicing that and even though she felt all that, she still had faith in God.
00:30:32.686 --> 00:30:50.178
So yeah, Awesome, so we're down last minute or so Just because we got another interview set up and so, yeah, it was one of those, one of those days.
00:30:50.826 --> 00:30:51.750
We just get caught up.
00:30:52.224 --> 00:30:53.811
Yeah, they're just back to back, back to back.
00:30:53.811 --> 00:31:08.807
But my final thought today and we want to when we, when you get ready to give your final thought, could you share where they can get your book and anything else that you have for our audience to be able to get from you?
00:31:08.807 --> 00:31:16.788
But my final thought is just simply that you know his word doesn't change.
00:31:16.788 --> 00:31:23.788
The truth doesn't change, whether it's in regard to something that has happened in your life, in the life of somebody else.
00:31:23.788 --> 00:31:33.334
The truth in regard to the word truth can't and it won't change, no matter how we feel about it, no matter the situation.
00:31:33.334 --> 00:31:34.757
It won't change.
00:31:34.757 --> 00:31:38.130
But you stay faithful to the one who is faithful.
00:31:38.130 --> 00:31:52.096
God is faithful to us and he'll never leave us and he won't forsake us, even though it might feel like it, it might seem like it, it might look like it Right, but he's always there and there's a reason why you're where you are, in the season that you are.
00:31:52.486 --> 00:31:58.207
So don't be, don't give up and don't quit and fear, not know that he is with you.
00:31:58.207 --> 00:31:59.269
That's my final word.
00:32:00.530 --> 00:32:01.811
My final word is this.
00:32:01.811 --> 00:32:07.940
It comes in the form of a question, three scriptures and a song.
00:32:07.940 --> 00:32:11.387
Back to another question.
00:32:11.387 --> 00:32:12.490
In God we trust.
00:32:12.490 --> 00:32:15.914
Do we really trust God?
00:32:15.914 --> 00:32:17.817
That's the ultimate question.
00:32:17.817 --> 00:32:18.919
Because you think about it.
00:32:27.809 --> 00:32:30.375
Hebrews 13 and 6 says he's the same God, today, tomorrow and forever.
00:32:30.375 --> 00:32:32.721
John 14 and 6, Jesus said unto him I'm the way, the truth and the life.
00:32:32.721 --> 00:32:34.226
No man comes to the Father but by me.
00:32:34.226 --> 00:32:35.627
Numbers 23 and 19,.
00:32:35.627 --> 00:32:38.569
God is not a man that shall lie, nor a son of man that shall repent.
00:32:38.569 --> 00:32:41.673
Question again do you really trust God?
00:32:41.673 --> 00:32:47.558
Because in the song there's a song that says God, give me your eyes.
00:32:48.118 --> 00:32:50.260
Do we really want to see the things that God sees?
00:32:50.260 --> 00:32:54.894
Come on, Do we really want to see the things God sees?
00:32:54.894 --> 00:32:59.415
Because he tells us that he loves us.
00:32:59.415 --> 00:33:01.829
He really does love us.
00:33:01.829 --> 00:33:04.738
Because you think back to when he was crucified.
00:33:04.738 --> 00:33:08.315
His last words was Father, forgive them.
00:33:08.315 --> 00:33:20.272
They crucified him, they beat him, they whipped him, they tore his flesh, they made a mockery of him, they spit in his face, but he still said Father, forgive them.
00:33:22.366 --> 00:33:23.692
Do we really trust God?
